[topcat]

A quick composite………….

A Quick JAM Composite

[topcat]

………….and another………………

Another Simple Sampler

[dianablanton1984Member]

Impressive samplers, Tracy!

[topcat]

Thanks…. Just getting around to transferring reels that have been sitting on the shelf for twenty-five years.

[Admin]

the jingle man wrote:
i had no idea that TM got a crack at WOGL in phillie before they went to the top dallas powerhouse!

Before the Rock & Roll Classic TOH, WOGL also purchased resings of Miami's WAXY in Dec 1988.

[topcat]

WNBC – New York City… Composite of TM cuts from mid-1976……

WNBC New York, NY – TM Composite (1976)

[topcat]

I had to pull so cuts for a project this morning…. so I made a quick TM composite of a few of the stereo remixes on the DVD. I wasn't sure if I'd posted these before….

A Quick TM Stereo Composite

[topcat]

jessie wrote:
I have just read this entire thread from start to finish and there are some amazing stories behind the jingles. Thank you for all of the samplers (most of which are still active!) and also for bringing the discussion back

You're welcome. I've tried to pull interesting things out along the way to share with the community. I've also housed the samplers outside of JM so that I have control of their existence. If there are any missing, it's likely due to crashes when we moved the servers from California to Jersey. While I never made backups of them, there are a few people here that did.

If you (or anyone else) notice dead links, let me know and I'll try to get them reposted with the help of others.

-TC

[jingle1]

topcat wrote:
WNBC – New York City… Composite of TM cuts from mid-1976……

After hearing these, I am kind of confused as to which order WNBC used jingles. My best recollection was “Design 70/72”, “Image 73”, the Toby Arnold Package, the 1975 PAMS custom (first to use the NBC logo), “You”…..PAMS Iconogenics was in there somewhere. I don't remember these TM resings (Image 73, Propellants, etc.) with the NBC logo on the air, but I have several on CD here somewhere. I know when Pittman showed up, the jingles were gone.

Tom

[topcat]

Tom

Your guess is as good as mine. These cuts were dubbed from the WNBC masters (not from TM) so they were at the station. My bet is that these were used somewhere in the John Lund era at WNBC, but I have no way of verifying that. To me, it's bizarre hearing the Image '73 package with the G-E-C logo on 'em.

-TC

[OBieInDC]

I was at WNBC at during the Perry Basom/Don Shafer/Jack Singleton era. We used the Heller stuff in 1968-1969. Then Don & Jim Long decided on Design 70. Later when Pat Whitley came on board they went with a custom package. Don't recall any package from Tony Arnold. I know Tommy Gwin did a few “spec” cuts that sounded great but management wanted to stay with TM.

[Barras]

Hi Tom,

I found these jingles for WNBC by Toby Arnold, perhaps they were “on-air” after you were at WNBC…

http://jinglemad.com/e107_files/public/1298937332_3680_FT8343_toby_arnold_wnbc.mp3 filename:toby_arnold_wnbc.mp3

[OBieInDC]

David….

Right…they must have aired after I left. I never heard that package before….thanks for sharing…

tom

[jingle1]

OBieInFL wrote:
I was at WNBC at during the Perry Basom/Don Shafer/Jack Singleton era. We used the Heller stuff in 1968-1969. Then Don & Jim Long decided on Design 70. Later when Pat Whitley came on board they went with a custom package. Don't recall any package from Tony Arnold. I know Tommy Gwin did a few “spec” cuts that sounded great but management wanted to stay with TM.

I remember the Toby Arnold jingles were used when Wolfman did evenings, so maybe 1974? Pat Whitley must have been involved with the PAMS 1975 Custom, since he used several of those jingles when he went to WMEX. As for PAMS Iconogenics, the demo uses Perry Bascom and John Lund's names at the beginning, so what year would that be?

There is also a tape floating around with the TM “You” package using a different logo; I assume this may have pre-dated the PAMS 1975 Custom. I'm not sure what the story was there.

Tom

[OBieInDC]

Boy, Tom….

I don't remember Pat EVER wanting to buy PAMS. The last packge I remember before I went to Cleveland was TM's Summer of 72. He went ga-ga over it.

John Lund came way after me.

[jingle1]

OBieInFL wrote:
Boy, Tom….

I don't remember Pat EVER wanting to buy PAMS. The last packge I remember before I went to Cleveland was TM's Summer of 72. He went ga-ga over it.

John Lund came way after me.

You know, you are right….John Lund was at WGAR and got all those PAMS resings done in the early '70s. He then went to WNBC, and I would guess was instrumental in switching WNBC to PAMS. He was the one that moved Cousin Brucie from evenings to middays, and that's about when the PAMS jingles went on the air.

Tom

[tvnutboy]

topcat wrote:
WNBC – New York City… Composite of TM cuts from mid-1976……

WNBC New York, NY – TM Composite (1976)

I don't mean to open a can of worms here, but something is bothering me about one of the jingles in this sampler. Namely the one that starts up @ the :28 point. I was listening to it, and I thought it sounded familiar. Sure enough after doing some research, I came across this old Promo for the ABC network circa 1974…

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qj1W_mLkJM0

So this begs me to ask, was TM responsible for the ABC Jingle & then re-wrote it for radio stations? Or is this a different company altogether that did the TV jingle 2 Years before the radio jingles came out?

[topcat]

According to the late Jim West, the first client he sold to for TM when he started there after leaving PAMS was WNBC in 1970. That's when the Design '70 custom was produced.

There were follow-ups with Design '72 and Free Design over the next few years and that gawd-awful Summer of '72 custom.

Iconogenics was a crappy little custom package that PAMS did to try to sell WNBC on using their jingles. At around the same time, give or take, PAMS had done the jingles for NIS, the short-lived NBC all-news format they were pushing around the country. I honestly don't recall ever hearing the package on the air until the cuts were used in the TIME MACHINE era.

In 1974, John Lund came to WNBC from Cleveland. By that time, WABC no longer held the PAMS exclusivity. In fact, WABC, I believe, was using cuts from THUNDER followed by JAM. This left the PAMS coffers open to John to cherry pick through.

The first cuts they went back were from WLS '71; Series 40 and a bunch of others. Hell… They even resang the “woman with a man in mind” cut for Cousin Brucie from Series 30.

In 1974, a custom was produced in conjunction with WNBC and KNBR. There are a bunch of cuts that were sung with both call letters, but also a lot that only were sung for WNBC or KNBR. I remember hearing (and airchecking) these cuts on the air. The lineup at the time was Imus; Cousin Brucie; Bob “Vernon with a V”; Oogie Pringle; and Dick Summer.

Don't ask me when… but WNBC then went and purchased cuts from TM's You Campaign. Originally, they were sung with the wrong logo… so they went back and resang them with the GEC/NBC logo.

Its funny, 'cause I can't remember the program director after John Lund. Mel something-or-other. I remember writing him a letter asking him for a dub of their master reels. He wrote back saying that they weren't available since they were no longer “in the building”.

[tyty21]

while we're on the subject of TM here, one quick question. were there resings of there 70's and 80's packages resung for the stations of the 90's and 2000? i know jam had plenty of 80's resings, some 70's resings were done, did TM ever do that?

[IainJohnstonMember]

Its often been said that huge amounts of pre-1980 TM tapes were binned/dumpstered during one of the many mergers/takeovers etc, so not much post-1980 resings, other maybe than via iJingles at post-20th century TM.

Obviously the “You” tracks still existed (e.g. for Jack FM) and a few other items still probably lurk. But nothing like the quantity of “heritage” of PAMS and JAM as preserved by JMW, MPF, etc.

I think TC is maybe the best authority on this one???

[topcat]

When we got into the TM archives in 2000, the reference reels (with the exception of around 50 7″ reels) Pre-Mid 1979 were dumpstered. From what I found out, the previous management team went into Regal Row, where they were stored, and tossed them all out one weekend.

Now you have to understand what volume of materials we're talking about. When TM sang a package, they kept both a copy of the mix-down (what was sent to the station, known as a reference reel) AND the 1″ 8-Track reel that was originally sung so they could go in and remix, if necessary. I'm told there were somewhere between 25,000 and 40,000 reels that went into the landfill.

As for the original backing track reels, most of those are up here in Massachusetts save a rack or two of reels still down in Dallas. Those are in formats starting with 1/2″ 4-Track; 1″ 8-Track; 2″ 16 / 24 Track. Of course the challenge is figuring out where they are if someone is looking for an obscure cut.

The multi-tracks that they still sing to regularly, like THE YOU CAMPAIGN, have been copied over into the digital domain and that's mainly what they're singing to in Dallas. Of course, there are exceptions to that too. They just did some resings of SHOCKWAVE, and I provided them with Two Track reduction to sing to.

In some cases, like when Ron Sidaille at WDRC wants to purchase cuts from older packages, they call me since no one in-house knows the older packages. In some cases, I've already transferred 4-Track reduction reels of the early 1970's packages to digital and given copies back to TM so I can pick up my notebook and tell them right where they'll find the backing track. But, this is one place where JAM has an advantage as Jon knows all of the packages and the master reels are at his fingertips.

Questions?

[IainJohnstonMember]

Thanks TC!

1) “reference reels …somewhere between 25,000 and 40,000 reels that went into the landfill”
THAT still saddens me, thats a LOT of radio heritage.

2) “original backing track reels, most of those are up here…the challenge is figuring out where they are if someone is looking for an obscure cut…backing track”
THAT cheers me up again!

Does TM's iJingles service offer small-order Personal Cut resings (economically) back to the early 70s era using that track material, or is the time/expense of dredging out a single backing track and scoring vocals for it get a bit too prohibitive?

[tyty21]

i sort of new jack as a possible one, but i was thinking more along the lines of the 70's and 80's top40/classic hits packages, you know, fusian, phase 2, sound 70, airpower, and others.

[topcat]

Wixy1360 wrote:
Does TM's iJingles service offer small-order Personal Cut resings (economically) back to the early 70s era using that track material, or is the time/expense of dredging out a single backing track and scoring vocals for it get a bit too prohibitive?

That's something you'd have to discuss with Sean Martin.

I have made available back to TM 4-track reduction transfers of Sound '70; Charisma; Sound of Chicago; Plays The Hits; Phase II; Where Your Friends Are; Design '70; Design '72; Free Design… as I recall. There may have been more, as that was several years ago.

However, there is the added expense of having to adapt the cut from scratch as it's likely no one else has had a resing of it. Also, some of those cuts are lengthy, so I guess they'd be priced higher since it takes more studio time to sing them.

Again… Sean Martin would be the one who could answer that question best.

[IainJohnstonMember]

Thanks TC – I knew Sean had some older TM available, just didn't know what!

So I hope this might alert a few JMers to what might be available there for Personal Cuts using classic TM rather than just the 1980s/90s material.

WNBC – harking back to PAMS 1975 etc – for those who haven't had the (mis?)fortune to hear the PAMS Iconogenics custom for WNBC post-TM, I've put the cuts up on the JMcloud, with the Demo to follow.

(…nice concept of using the G-E-C notes in the logo, which of course extended into the JAM era (General Electric Company of the USA owned RCA, Radio Corporation of America, who owned the National Broadcasting Company…NBC…who Owned & Operated WNBC…) but a really ghastly demo presentation, especially the faked-up “posh Englishman” who sounds like a terrible parody of Prince Charles…)

As for the jingles…IMPO the TM Design customs were far superior in production & content…they'll be on the JMcloud shortly.

[Author]

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