[danjamesuk]

Well, at long last it’s here. Check out the brand new BBC Radio Leeds package at http://www.iqbeats.com. They’re using a new composer on many of these cuts – listen to the tracks – amazing!

[NickySMember]

I think the tracks are very good … but think the singing lets some of the cuts down.

[mbMember]

Nicky – you bear me to it ))
Finally some BBC cuts with a bit of life and the death of the “optomistic chimes” – Most BBC local imaging seems to have gone backards – listen to some old Alfasound or David Arnold stuff and its way pacier.
I quite like the music but some of the vocals sound a bit weak

[BrammyMember]

Did they run out of money after the music tracks and get the office juniors to do the vocals!

They are terrible!!

[mbMember]

The vocals suffer the same problem as the LBC ones – they are simply to weak and lack a certain amount of cut through and authority that you expacr from a BBC station. Clive Bull has a jingle that sings Cli Bull and the Nick Ferrari cuts have lost the t from breakfast. The poll last week was about Group Harmonies but sometimers solo singers dont have the same power as a group be it Reelworld, JAM, ot TM.

[danjamesuk]

I would have been inclined to agree with the comments here about the vocals sounding weak, however I’ve just listened to the package in my studio with the cuts whacked through the finalizer, and they sound MUCH stronger.

I know that sometimes a programmer will ask for their jingles to be (a) sung in a certain way, in much the same way as I’ll ask a voiceover to deliver a script in a specific way and (b) will often ask for the vocals on their cuts to be left pretty much untreated, so that the FM processing will do all the hard work in pumping them up. Therefore, it’s not always right to lay the blame at the feet of the jingle producers… as I’ve found myself when working to a client’s (occasionally incredibly restrictive) brief.

Overall, a great job from IQ and some of the best tracks I’ve heard in a long time. However, perhaps a larger group vocal would’ve improved them still further. Maybe we’ll find out in a future resing?

D.

[mbMember]

fair comment – demos and listening to cuts in isolation always make the cuts a little bit antiseptic – actrually coming through your tranny the stuff always sounds different – its a trait that I also find with N2effect – suppose trying to move away from that “Dallas” group sound but I do personally like a strong vocal.

[Jonnyh]

Good God, I haven’t heard such rubbish since Music4 last launched a new package.

You can’t even understand the names of the presenters – did the singers all have speech impediments???

I didn’t believe that jingles could get any worse for UK radio stations than they have done recently. But they just have.

The jingles sound like very poor immitations of Jam cuts. They’re trying to create the showbiz glitz with none of the talent.

One of these days, radio station bosses in this country are going to wake up and realise that if they want a ‘BIG’, glitzy, musical jingle package they need to go to JAM where they actually know how to make the bloody things!

[RjM]

Jonnyh wrote: One of these days, radio station bosses in this country are going to wake up and realise that if they want a ‘BIG’, glitzy, musical jingle package they need to go to JAM where they actually know how to make the bloody things!

Completely agree, JAM would’ve gone to town with the brief this package had. You only have to listen to the ‘Radio 2 Collection’ package to hear the versatility JAM can offer.

[danjamesuk]

Perhaps a little decorum, jonnyh? You must remember that people who work in the industry also read these forums and some of your remarks are pretty offensive! (In case you’re wondering, I don’t work for IQ Beats!). With artistic licence, an old phrase: “criticism is a dish best served constructively”!!

---

It appears to me that many people here like the tracks, but not the vocals. Yet looking at the forum here most people think the package is poor. As a jingle collector of many years now, I’ve always been under the impression it’s not just the vocals that count, yet this poll doesn’t seem to bear this out. Perhaps we’re back to the debate I recall having some months ago…

I think I speak on behalf of almost all of us when I say JAM is a bloody good jingle company, and undoubtedly have produced some of the best radio jingles of all time. However, JAM are good at what the client’s brief requires them to do (as are most ID companies), and this brief I don’t believe would have suited them, just as the WKTU package was out of JAM’s reach.

Every jingle company, including IQ Beats, has a shelf life. We’ve seen PAMS experience their heyday, then fade. We’ve seen the same with Alfasound, David Arnold Music, and TM Century (who only a few weeks were trying to pitch their business to me, as they really want to retain a foothold in the UK market). Music 4 are going off the boil, as we’ve heard most of their new material before, and Reelworld are also beginning to sound a little unfashionable (just listen to their recent Viking FM package, and their Capital cuts, I believe, are simply acapellas, mixed by the creative team at Capital Sonics).

Like all the above, IQ Beats also have their own ‘signature sound’ which, once the market is saturated with their material, will, given time, start to sound old hat, and they too will become a distant collector and programmer’s memory.

JAM’s demise in the CHR market, for example, came shortly after producing their final package for Radio 1. The industry no longer had a need for close part Dallas harmony; it needed something new and cutting edge. It got it, with Reelworld, IQ Beats, and even some of the last Alfa packages (for Kiss 102 and Kiss 105, for example). JAM did not evolve. Perhaps they didn’t want to, knowing there was still a market for their kind of work, which of course there is.

The jingle business is staffed by incredibly talented people who know music, and know radio. As collectors, perhaps we should lend them our support and offer them our polite, constructive criticism, rather than sit here as self-appointed jingle Gods, judging everything they produce (with an iron rod) based upon what WE see as ‘the perfect jingle’.

I work for a creative team in London, where I frequently have to take briefs from clients. I go into these meetings, full of ideas that I think could really work, sound powerful and perform effectively on air. Often, a client will have a black and white view of exactly where they want their campaign to go, so if my persuasion to do otherwise fails, I will produce what I’m told (and paid) to produce. In the radio industry, as everywhere else, there are customers who use services. Those who use jingle services go in there with specific project briefs. What they ask for, is normally EXACTLY what they get.

Read the testimonial from Radio Leeds Editor John Ryan on the IQ Beats News page. Read the many other testimonials, and those on the pages of other jingle companies you don’t necessarily like, and ask yourself a question…

“Am I judging these jingles based upon my own nostalgic, personal favourites, or am I judging them based upon how they sound in TODAY’S radio market, the quality of instrumentation, the originality of the cuts? Am I taking into consideration the fact that this isn’t ONLY the work of the jingle company, but of the client too? CAN I see past the fact, and accept it, that 5 part Dallas harmonies are no longer in vogue?”

And then, with a more open mind, maybe reassess?

Just a thought, and absolutely no offence intended!

D.

[Jonnyh]

Hi Dan!

No I really am not judging this package based on nostalgia.

I am basing it on the fact that the cuts just don’t work. Whilst the instrumental tracks may be ‘okay’ (and by that I mean that they stand up, just not terribly well), the vocals are absolutely awful. I have never heard BBC Radio Leeds and am therefore unfamiliar with any of the presenter names. Having listened to their new presenter ramps, I’m still unaware of their names – I can’t understand what they’re singing! Now tell me – what use is that? A jingle is supposed to jump out and smack you in the chops with it’s message – if you can’t understand what is being said to you (or sung) what’s the pont?

I honestly believe Jam would have done a better job on this package. I even belive that TM century, Thompson Creative or Reelworld would have done a better job.

Don’t get me wrong. If BBC Radio Leeds is happy with this package then that’s absolutely fine with me. To be honest as someone who doesn’t even live clost to their patch I couldn’t care less. What I do get passionate about is the downward spiral of todays radio jingles. They rarely work anymore because radio stations go to companies who don’t really know what they’re doing. They’re trying to be a ‘modern JAM’ – but unfortunately don’t have the skills, the talent or the experience to re-produce a more modern Jam sound.

I certainly don’t mean to cause offense to anyone who loves these jingles. However, passion is one of the spices of life and surely it makes chat forums a more interesting place when people speak from the heart.

[danjamesuk]

I’m not talking about you offending the people who love these jingles; I’m talking about you offending the passionate people who make them, and also view these forums.

How CAN you say the cuts don’t work when you’ve never even heard them on air? Even if you sit there and mock up your own show using these jingles, you STILL won’t know whether or not they work on air, UNLESS you intricately know the style and direction of the station they’re being played on. Please, no offence, but if you’re going to make a sweeping statement like “they don’t work on air” having not even HEARD them on air, then you’re not really in a position to comment! Just my opinion!

You’ve also struck the nail right on the head. You’ve never listened to Radio Leeds, and you don’t live in an area where you CAN listen to it. You’ve only listened to these idents in isolation. Jingles are designed to match the station’s personality and work well with the air talent. They’re not designed to make collectors happy. They’re not designed to be listened to in isolation. They’re designed to be solid, dependable branding tools. The logo melody, the instrumentation, the vocal groups. Everything is designed to make a station SOUND unique, and you don’t do that just by using close part harmonies.

Speaking as a one-time programme director, presenter and now creative writer/producer working in the fields of both advertising and programming, I can tell you, without any hesitation whatsoever, that today’s radio HAS to evolve. Presenters come and go; presentation styles change. Content changes; production techniques are re-invented.

Everything has to be re-invented in every radio station’s lifecycle. Otherwise the only listeners left would be those who listen for nostalgia’s sake alone. Just like those who still believe that the only company that should be making jingles is JAM.

But, of course, everyone’s entitled to their opinion, and this is mine.

Oh, and as an aside; does anyone know WHAT the modern JAM sound is? I don’t even think THEY know, considering they’ve produced nothing ‘modern’ for a while!

D.

[DevawebMember]

Not wishing to leap into the BBC Leeds debate at the moment (seeing as I spend the last 2 years at one of their commercial rivals, and now work for the Beeb itself), I’d like to put this point forward.

The first time I heard the Heart 106.2 package from IQ Beats, I really wasn’t sure about it at all. It got very mixed reviews on JingleMad as well.

However, on air it fits perfectly; it’s superb. It matches the station so well and the way that they use it on air. Out of context it’s still not as anorak-friendly as maybe a JAM demo though, but as Dan says, it’s about the station and what they want.

What I do get passionate about is the downward spiral of todays radio jingles. They rarely work anymore because radio stations go to companies who don’t really know what they’re doing.

You’re joking, right? There has never been so much choice for radio stations, from a superb range of companies offering all styles of imaging. I fear that you’re living in the past, and don’t fully understand what stations actually wish to achieve from their branding. In the cut-throat radio markets of most part of the UK, it’s a multi million pound business. No longer is it a case of calling up Steve England, seeing which JAM package will fit your slogan and call sign, writing some words and waiting for the reel/CD to turn up.

I do hope you can all come to the Jingle day and discuss this at length.

Chris

[Inferno]

danjamesuk wrote:

Oh, and as an aside; does anyone know WHAT the modern JAM sound is? I don’t even think THEY know, considering they’ve produced nothing ‘modern’ for a while!

D.

JAM’s 92 PRO FM package was a good CHR package. They have the ability to do CHR and do it well with better singers too! Non of the screechy vocals like from Reelworld. However it seems JAM is labled,for the time being, to be a jingle company for AC and gold formats. JAM seem to be holding their cards close to their chests regarding new material. I wish they wouldnt!!!

COME ON JAM! LETS HEAR SOME NEW MATERIAL ON YOUR WEBSITE!

[danjamesuk]

Oops, you got me on that one, and yes it’s a very good package. However, it’s still very JAM, and whilst I LOVE their work and most of it is indeed hard to fault, many programmers now find their work very passe.

[danjamesuk]

Is it me, or do the presenter IDs sound much clearer today? I think they may have been remixed… they sound much nicer now.

[cubwolfMember]

I cant get anything on their site to play?
It just says opening

I think its a setting on my laptop as i have just done a format on it.
Any ideas anyone (I have downloaded flash)

[Author]

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